Brenda Winkle 00:00:01 Welcome to your yes filled life. I'm Brenda Winkle, energetic leadership guide, psychic, medium and somatic coach for ambitious leaders who know their gifts are real and who want to stand fully in them. Here you'll learn how to trust your intuition, embody your vision, and step into the freedom you've been creating, all without chasing more certifications or carrying stuff that does not belong to you. Every week, I'll share powerful practices and conversations with thought leaders and changemakers that help you transform your vision into embodied confidence. Claim your gifts without apology and lead with both clarity and freedom. Because your gifts aren't cute. They are powerful. They're real, and they're needed. Start today by downloading my free energy audit at Brenda Winkle forward slash audit. It's the exact tool I use to track what's fueling me and what's draining me. It will help you discern between that hit of achievement and true joy, so that you can lead with more clarity and impact. This is your space to stop proving, start embodying and live fully in your gifts.
Brenda Winkle 00:01:16 Welcome to your yes filled life. Hello and welcome to your yes filled life. I'm your host, Brenda Winkle, intuitive guide, somatic coach, psychic medium. And I'm so excited today to be bringing you a very special guest. This is my friend and my dog, Bentley's dog trainer, Gia Voce. Now, Gia is a dog behavior expert and entrepreneur. She built her successful behavior practice thinking canine and then expanded to social media. She has the largest social media following of any positive reinforcement trainer In the world. And that is exactly how I found her and exactly why I hired her. Because her social media is so on point that I knew she was the expert of experts, and that was exactly who I wanted to work with. And I feel so grateful that not only have I gotten a chance to work with her, but that we have become friends now. Before we dive into the episode, I want to share something really important, especially if you're someone who feels deeply, leads intuitively, and knows you're meant for more in your work.
Brenda Winkle 00:02:33 One of the things I love most about Gia and you're going to get to hear about this, is how fully she trusts herself. She listens to her intuition without apologizing for it. She does the things that scare her because they scare her, and she lives her life in a way that is deeply attuned, courageous and aligned. And I so admire that. That's this kind of self trust. That's also the core of the work that I teach inside the Intuitive Somatic Healer certification. It's a six week advanced training for practitioners who already sense what's happening in their clients bodies and fields and hearts, but want to learn how to interpret that information with clarity, confidence, and ethical precision. If you've ever felt something in a session and didn't quite know how to use it, or if you've wanted to integrate intuition and somatic in a clean, grounded way, this certification is going to change everything. You'll learn how to read somatic cues, how to interpret intuitive information, how to choose the right tool in the moment, and how to support deeper client breakthroughs without guessing, overstepping, or burning yourself out.
Brenda Winkle 00:03:49 Enrollment is open now, and there are only 20 spots two are already taking, so if your body is leaning in, you can learn more about it in the link in the show notes. Now, before we dive into this episode with Gia. Gia has a very special gift for you. It's a free downloadable book called ten tips for Building a Healthy Relationship with Your Dog. A quick guide full of tips to help you develop a cooperative relationship with your dog. I'm putting the link in the show notes. Make sure you go visit and make sure that you follow her across all her platforms on social media. As soon as you get done listening to this episode. All right. Let's dive in. I can't wait to introduce you to Gia.
Speaker 2 00:04:29 Hi, Gia. I'm so glad you're here.
Gia Voce 00:04:32 Thank you. I'm glad to be here, too. I'm very excited. I just love your podcast. Oh, listen to many episodes. It's like you're in the room with me, and we're just having a talk.
Gia Voce 00:04:42 A one sided talk, you know, but with a friend.
Speaker 2 00:04:47 Oh, I love that. I love that, so I love to ask this question to kind of kick things off, which is what is one thing you either did or did not do. That has led to your yes filled life.
Gia Voce 00:05:00 I mean, I think the biggest thing I, I do is I push myself and if something scares me, I'm like, I have to do it now. Now we just have to try it.
Speaker 2 00:05:10 So I know that to be true. Just from from being in your world for the last like 7 or 8 months. And I just admire that so much.
Gia Voce 00:05:20 Thank you. Yeah, I think that's my biggest thing. People are often like, wow, you're so you're so brave, you're fearless. And I'm like, no, no, no, I'm brave, but I'm definitely not fearless. You know, many, many things scare me and I just happen to do those things.
Speaker 2 00:05:35 I relate to that because I do things scared.
Speaker 2 00:05:39 It's not that there's an absence of fear. Yeah. I'm just doing it sitting with the fear.
Gia Voce 00:05:45 Exactly.
Speaker 2 00:05:46 Yeah. And you're doing something really big right now. Yeah. Do you want to talk about it?
Gia Voce 00:05:51 Sure. So, I am purchasing a estate in Portugal and moving there full time. I sold my house. I'm leaving it in less than a month and packing up all my stuff and all my pets. All five. And I'm pivoting my business completely.
Speaker 2 00:06:13 Congratulations.
Gia Voce 00:06:14 Changing my life.
Speaker 2 00:06:16 I love it so this is like the epitome of your gospel. Life is like chasing the thing that you really want to do because this has not been a fast journey. It's you've taken your time, you've done your research, and and you had to be really patient.
Gia Voce 00:06:36 Absolutely. Yeah. So I visited Portugal first almost two years ago on a whim. I was going to go to Ecuador, but there was civil unrest and curfews and it was like, not safe. And it wasn't going to be a fun trip.
Gia Voce 00:06:48 So I had to pivot and I was like, oh, maybe instead of like, South America, I'll do Europe. And then I was like, okay, I've already lived in France. What's the warmest, coolest place? And, you know, everybody talks about Portugal. So I decided to go to Portugal. And I think a week and a half later I was there.
Speaker 2 00:07:09 I love how you work because so many times we've gotten and I've buried the lead here, we'll have to come back to it. But so many times we have gotten ready to be on a call and you're like, oh, and next week I'm going to XYZ, whatever that is. I, I love that ability that you have to just follow the the nudge.
Gia Voce 00:07:27 Yeah, absolutely. And I have the freedom to do it because of how I've structured my life. And when I don't have the freedom to and I figure out how to do it.
Speaker 2 00:07:37 You do? Yeah, you do. So I mentioned I buried the lead, which is that you are my dog, Bentley's trainer, and you very much saved his life.
Speaker 2 00:07:50 And you've changed mine.
Gia Voce 00:07:52 Well. Thank you.
Speaker 2 00:07:53 Yeah. Thank you. Thank you. Thank goodness for Instagram and for your presence on Instagram. Because that is how I found you.
Gia Voce 00:08:01 Yeah. And what made you choose me?
Speaker 2 00:08:05 I had followed several trainers, many, many trainers over the years. Just because I love dogs, I love training, I had foster dogs and I considered myself to be like pretty okay at figuring out the average stuff. Well, when I got Bentley, I knew I was in over my head, so I started looking for anxious dogs is what I was searching for. And you came up in one of my very first searches for anxious dogs, and I started learning from you in a way that I hadn't learned from anyone. And you broke it down, like, what's the dog thinking? What's the dog feeling? And then I was able to modify some of my behaviors, my behaviors, which modified his behavior year before I'd even met you. And in so many of the other videos, it was sort of entertainment value only where I can watch a trainer train, but I wasn't able to necessarily replicate it.
Speaker 2 00:09:00 But with the videos that you posted and the explanations you offered, I was like, oh, I could try this. And so then when we had our incident, which I have mentioned on the podcast, but not actually explained it, and I'm happy to actually explain it, I was like, okay, it is time, I need support, or I'm going to be in big trouble. Because what happened was we had gone to a pet store that we had gone to every day for the past year, and I was paying our for whatever we bought. And at that moment, a little dog came up behind us and I was pulling my wallet out and Bentley ran towards the dog. I had known he was anxious. I had even said he was reactive, but honestly, I don't think I knew what that meant really. And he went to go bite the dog and the dog's owner put his leg up in front of Bentley, and Bentley's teeth made contact with the man's shin, which is considered a bite because it it was, you know, tooth on skin.
Speaker 2 00:10:00 And so I went down the whole rabbit hole of needing a bite report and, you know, being reported to I don't know if it was animal control or whatever it was, I don't remember, but it was really quite traumatic. It was traumatic in the moment. And then it continued to be traumatic after, as I was, you know, navigating paying for medical bills and then realizing I'm in way over my head with Bentley.
Gia Voce 00:10:26 And I think so many pet parents have your same story. They have a dog that's having problems, and they're kind of doing things alone, and then they have an accident and then it's devastating, you know, because everybody thinks, like, my dog would never my dog would never bite, my dog would never do this. And there's a first time for everything. Yeah. Yeah.
Speaker 2 00:10:51 Yeah. And when I met with you the first time, one of the things I felt was, like, so much gratitude. Because I had carried tremendous shame around not understanding how serious this was.
Speaker 2 00:11:04 Like, I feel tears in my eyes just talking about it. I just didn't. I didn't know. And you taught me a lot about what reactivity really means. And maybe the listeners would love to know, like when you're talking about a dog that has these troubles, what it might look like before there's an accident.
Gia Voce 00:11:26 Yeah. So I would say. I don't know, 80% of the dogs I work with have fear based aggression. And what it starts out looking like, like when it's just kind of starting often is that the dog is like not warm with strangers. So they're not barking or lunging or doing anything, but they're not particularly happy to see people or other dogs and their stress signals. And it might just be with like one person or one dog. They meet in like a hundred, but it's like the writing on the wall and there's something there. There's something to it. And then we also see like generalized anxiety. So we see dogs that are struggling in day to day life. They're hyper.
Gia Voce 00:12:08 They can't settle down. They are constantly window watching. They're on edge, they're destructive, they are demanding, and they're just not the most easy dogs to live with. Many of the dogs we see and, yeah, anytime a pet shows any kind of fear other than like one, a one off an extreme, we have to look at it to. We have to think about like, is it possible that this is writing on the wall that this could get worse, that this is a symptom that's just starting now and can get worse? And then the other thing we see in like a lot of the patients, a lot, a lot. I think more than 50% at this point is some kind of a physical issue where the pet is in pain. And that was true for Bentley because of, you know, getting hit by a car. Right. Yes. And, often animals that are in pain, they don't understand why they're in pain, because they're an animal. They can't, you know, have thought like that.
Gia Voce 00:13:09 Like, oh, my leg hurts. This must be because I got hit by a car three years ago. They think like I'm startled. That made my leg hurt. You did this to me, and they tend to quickly ramp up their behaviors.
Speaker 2 00:13:24 In fact, you were the one. It was in our very first session that you said, oh, what is he doing right there. And has he always done that. Because that's a sign of pain. And I had light bulbs go off in my head because he was always licking and doing things, you know, with his hip and with his, his wrist on, on one leg. And I just thought it was a personality quirk. Yeah, like my daughter had even researched. Could dogs be like, what are signs of autism and dogs? And you're like, yeah, I don't think that's it.
Gia Voce 00:13:55 Yeah. And then you look at the whole picture like, okay, he likes to chew his toenails, or he likes to lick one leg.
Gia Voce 00:14:01 And then how does he jump on the couch? How does he move? How does he. Is he reticent, like hesitant to do certain things like a sit or a down or turn a circle in one way. And there are all things that we look at with pets. and often the primary care, you know, veterinarian misses these things because often dogs are so afraid at the vet that they're not showing pain because they have adrenaline.
Speaker 2 00:14:26 Right. And that was the case for us because he's extremely stressed at the vet. And since since that appointment, you recommended that we go to a rehab. But yes, which opened up the doors because the rehab vet said, oh yeah, for sure. He's in pain for sure. He's got some abnormalities here in his back hip. And so now we're on three medications, two for anxiety slash pain and an anti-inflammatory. And he's like a different dog. Yeah.
Gia Voce 00:14:58 So what did you notice from his treatment. His medical treatment.
Speaker 2 00:15:03 So medically we started with an anti-anxiety medication.
Speaker 2 00:15:07 And that was I would say by day three, I was noticing a difference in his level of anxiety. And some of the things that I had thought were personality, were anxiety, like you mentioned, the window watching and the inability to rest or lay down or get comfortable. I had thought he just was kind of, you know, on the hyper side. And I noticed that the zoomies that he'd been doing started to dissipate. I thought they were joyful zoomies. And now I'm realizing I'm not 100% sure they were joyful. I think they might have been like an anxiety discharge.
Gia Voce 00:15:45 Yeah.
Speaker 2 00:15:46 And so that was kind of the first set of things I noticed right away. And then there was an improvement in his reactivity with each time we've added the medication. And so it didn't go away. I don't want to say that. I mean, we've been working together for a while, and I'm diligent about training every day, many, many times of the day. But that one was the first. The first thing that really clicked in that worked.
Speaker 2 00:16:11 And then we added in, the it's gabapentin and I'm going to let you talk more about that because that's like both pain and anxiety, if I understand correctly. Yeah. And that's been really helpful. That was an instant game change to the point that when we went back to the rehab vet for our rehab therapy, he had been fearful and cowering and he wouldn't meet anybody. And when he went in the first time he was on gabapentin, they were like, who is this charming dog? Because he walked up to everybody and he greeted them and it was really different.
Gia Voce 00:16:48 Yeah. So often, you know, you're on social media, so you see what's going on. Like, many people are very anti behavioral medication. They think that behavioral medication is bad, that it's drugging dogs. and it couldn't be further from the truth. And many people will say oh we should use medication as a last resort, but with veterinary behaviorists and with myself, you know, we can see when a pet is suffering from a mental illness.
Gia Voce 00:17:18 Just like if you are a therapist or a psychiatrist, you can meet a person and speak with them and stare at them, and you can tell that there's something wrong. And so we recommend medication for pets that we can see have something going on in their brain, like as a first resort, because otherwise we're spinning our wheels with working with the dog. We're taking much longer, and we're not going to have the kind of outcome we could have with medicine. and some behavioral issues. They they just don't get better without medication. So my own dog, you know, she has a severe noise phobia. She was good for a very long time. No issues. Completely mentally solid and fearless. And then she had two, like, traumatizing incidents involving sound. And she went off the rails and immediately, you know, 5 or 10 years ago, I would have been like, okay, we're going to work through this. We're going to do these things to try to fix this. Now, I know, like with with severe noise phobia, if without medication, you're in trouble.
Gia Voce 00:18:24 so for my own personal dog, like right away medicine and gabapentin is a really great medication. Of course, like, different vet behaviors will do different things, and regular veterinarians will do different things, or they don't know about these medications so much. But gabapentin is amazing because it does seem to have an anti-anxiety effect. Well, we know it has an anti-anxiety effect from studies, but also it can help pets with pain and people. So it's like a double. Yeah, it does two jobs at once, and it's a very safe medication that you can use in different dosages depending on what your veterinarian says. And it's like a miracle for my dog and for your dog and for many, many, many of the dogs that we see. And, you know, so many people think of, oh, if you put your dog on medication, you're drugging them, they're going to be lethargic and tired, and it's just not the case. You know, we're not using these heavy hitting drugs like you would use in a hospital for a human being that's in psychosis.
Gia Voce 00:19:24 We're not, you know, knocking them down with Haldol. These are SSRIs and other anti-anxiety medications that you carefully give at the right dosage for your pet. And our goal is never to see sedation unless you're in a situation where you kind of want the pet to be a little sleepy. Like traveling or the vet. But the goal is that the pet is more of their old self, or better in some way. and yeah, these medications are extremely safe, well documented. Many are approved for use in humans. Some are even studied and are approved for use in dogs. And we see miracles. Dogs that ten years ago I would have been like, well, this is this is it. We can see complete complete turnaround.
Speaker 2 00:20:13 And that was that's been the case for us. I mean I Bentley I still think is classified as reactive technically because it, I'm very cautious and aware and very present when we're out in case we run into other dogs. But he responds to me now like he can hear my voice through whatever he's going through.
Speaker 2 00:20:33 And at the beginning he couldn't. It was like I wasn't even saying anything.
Gia Voce 00:20:37 Yeah, exactly. And it's it's interesting too. Like, I try to think of it about it like this. And this is how I explain it to clients. I'll say, like, your dog is experiencing a level of fear, and he's doing behaviors that a typical dog never hits that level. Never. Like never, never, never have I seen, my other two dogs that I have lose control emotionally the way neon will if she's spooked and that's something in her brain, like, or Bentley. Like most dogs and most people, they don't reach a level where they're screaming on the street and freaking out, and they have a panic attack and they can't hear you, and they're just completely fighting for their life in their mind. and so when we have a pet that can reach that level in situations where they shouldn't reach that level, we know there's something off in their brain.
Speaker 2 00:21:32 that's so good to know. So we've talked about sort of some of the signs that we might have a problem, and we've talked about a little bit of the way that we can treat a problem medically if we if we know we have one.
Speaker 2 00:21:44 And then, you know, I think the thing that really struck me is there's so many things that I can do that will make this better or worse. And when you like the way you just break it down about like, well, he's probably feeling this makes it just makes it so easy for me to have a better understanding of what to do. I'll give you an example. Like with the window watching. I literally didn't know what to do. And from previous trainers I've been taught to like put treats in a in a an empty soda can and just shake to try and sort of get them to shock out of it. Well, he didn't respond to that at all. It was like nothing happened. But you told me to give him a treat every time he looks at a dog and to to pull his gaze over. You know, treating. Treating, treating. Treating every time he looks. Yeah. And now we're at a point several months in where he will look to me. First he'll look at the dog and he'll look at me, and he's waiting for his treat.
Speaker 2 00:22:51 He doesn't bark. Yeah. And when we started, I did not see that as even something that could be remotely possible.
Gia Voce 00:22:59 Yeah. So our goal with training ultimately is that the pet feels better about their triggers and feel safe around their triggers. So we use food. It's called counter conditioning. We pair food with the triggers to try to reframe what a dog or what a person or what any scary thing is. So the pet starts to think like, oh, when I see a dog, I get a treat and they start to feel excited when they see a dog, rather than feel defensive and or a person or whatever they're afraid of. And it really works. And then gradually they stop even feeling the need to guard the house window, watch and be hypervigilant. I'm looking and then they start looking at us.
Speaker 2 00:23:41 Yeah yeah yeah.
Gia Voce 00:23:43 Yeah. And these things are what I do with a new puppy to prevent a problem from ever starting. Or when I move to a city with my dogs. right away, I'm rewarding them for noticing dogs outside the window, people outside the window, loud noises inside the apartment so that they, right off the bat, have good feelings associated with things that can be pretty threatening to a dog.
Speaker 2 00:24:05 So you just touched on something and I want to make sure I pull the thread on it every time you move locations. This training needs to be reinforced. Yeah. And so that the new place because they're anxious. Yeah. When I traveled for five months of last year with Bentley and I noticed that there was a three day mark every time we went someplace, there were at least three days where his anxiety was even more amplified. And then in the fourth day, he would kind of settle down. And I wish I would would have known all of the things I know now as, as we were doing that. But I love that you say we all need to be doing this for all of our dogs, not just our reactive or anxious or yeah, fearful dogs.
Gia Voce 00:24:49 We can really prevent problems from starting, especially when you move to a new place or you're traveling because now it's it's not a totally clean slate, but there are things that are a clean slate for them. So you can really get a lot of change going if you move.
Speaker 2 00:25:06 That's really cool. Yeah, that's really cool. And you also do a lot of work with dogs that have hurt somebody in rehabbing them. And how does that work? Do you ever get scared?
Gia Voce 00:25:20 Yeah. I mean, we work with some pretty scary dogs that have done like severe, severe injuries to people. I think like, yeah, some of the worst cases were 170 stitches to somebody's head and face. We've had dogs that have, yeah, done severe, severe damage to people's faces. And I really try to explain to people that they cannot let their dog loose to see what it will do with me, because I've had people do that in the past they want to see like, oh, what would my dog do? Like, I don't need to see what your dog is going to do. I can read what your dog is going to do if your dog, attack attacks me when I'm coming in your house because you didn't listen to me. I am going to have to sue you because it's like you letting your car back down the driveway over a mechanic.
Gia Voce 00:26:10 because some people, they they're, they're in they're in denial, and they, they just don't get it. They're in denial. They think their pet would be fine. They think, you know, nothing could possibly bad could happen. And it's up to us to really teach them about safety. So am I nervous sometimes, but I am now very, very clear about how somebody is to introduce their dog to me.
Speaker 2 00:26:37 I love that. And so one of the things that I was thinking about just now, when you said that is a situation that I had personally, where there's the neighbor dog, which we not so lovingly call the nemesis, and, you know, the nemesis owner, really thinks their dog is fine and really thinks that it's Bentley that is the only trigger for their dog. And you were saying that this is how denial looks in a lot of people? Yeah. So if somebody has a dog that is lunging or barking at other dogs or other people, what would you say?
Gia Voce 00:27:15 I would say they need to their they need to fix the behavior because not only is it dangerous, it can escalate.
Gia Voce 00:27:22 And the longer you take to try to fix an issue, the less likely it is that you're going to have a good outcome, and that a dog acting defensively in situations that are not a situation where they're actually in danger is very, very abnormal and problematic. So I need to get help.
Speaker 2 00:27:45 Yes, yes. I wish we would have come to you just a little bit earlier, but I'm sure glad we found you when we did.
Gia Voce 00:27:51 Yeah. I mean you found me early in some people they wait many, many, many years or they wait till it's court ordered.
Speaker 2 00:28:01 So is it ever too late.
Gia Voce 00:28:05 No I wouldn't say it's ever too late. But there are some dogs that are just not going to be able to be treated, just like there are some people that are going to be non responders for treatment. And so one red flag to look out for in a trainer. Is someone guaranteeing they can fix a problem or guaranteeing that they can make a dog. That's really hurt Somebody's safe again.
Gia Voce 00:28:28 It'd be like a psychiatrist saying that and a psychiatrist would lose their license. But dog training is really unregulated. So unless you have a very high level certification, people say whatever they want to say.
Speaker 2 00:28:40 Let's talk about how do you find a good trainer.
Gia Voce 00:28:44 So it's a little tricky. if you're in the US there's a few organizations that certify people. And I would say the best certification organization is the IAA BC. So you go to IR and you can see a bunch of people that are certified. They're really strict with their certification, and they have a behavior certification and a dog trainer certification that are both really good. And then also, like Karen Pryor Academy is a really good program for basic training. it's a program I always tell people, like, if you want to learn about dog training, take that program. So those are my two favorites.
Speaker 2 00:29:21 I love that. Are you going to take clients on when you move to Portugal?
Gia Voce 00:29:26 yeah. So I'm going to still see clients virtually. and I hope to, after I get settled there and figure out how to set everything up.
Gia Voce 00:29:36 with taxes and everything like that. Insurance, I hope to take some clients in Portugal for in person. The financial situation is very different than in New York. and so I will be drastically changing my prices to make it affordable for the average person there. And I'll take limited clients, so I'll do a sliding scale.
Speaker 2 00:30:00 I love that. I'm selfishly really, really happy. He'll still keep taking on clients, and I want to make sure that people know how they can find you. What are some ways people can find you?
Gia Voce 00:30:12 So I'm on Instagram and TikTok and Facebook. my handle is my business name thinking canine. And it's a n I n e. And also my website is thinking K9, and it's getting revamped. Very exciting.
Speaker 2 00:30:28 Oh, I love that. Yeah, it's so much fun. So we've talked about, like, how to find a good trainer. And then I forgot to tell you one part of the story. I mean, I don't I think I've told you, but I haven't told the listeners.
Speaker 2 00:30:42 One part of my story was the organization that I had adopted Bentley through recommended that I go through specific trainers that they had vetted, but they were all e collar training. And as a nervous system expert, I could not, in good faith, put Bentley into an e collar training because I knew that any kind of negative reinforcement would be even worse for his nervous system. And I wonder, can you talk about the science about e collars? Are you? And I know the answers, but just for the listeners. Pro e caller Connie caller what? Tell us all the things.
Gia Voce 00:31:22 So I personally don't use e collars. My certifications, that would be a big no no unless in very specific, specific situations that you would rarely come across. and I have lots of friends that use e collars and lots of colleagues, people that I talk to frequently and really, really like. So I am like open minded. You know, I'm not like, I will never talk to anybody that uses an e collar.
Gia Voce 00:31:49 I really don't care. But, I what I see in the industry is more people doing harm than they're doing good. And that's for maybe 99% of the people that train with with e collars. I'm seeing them do real harm. That's lasting harm to dogs. So technically with an electric collar, they're super sensitive these days. So you can set it at a level where it literally feels like somebody's touching your finger, like it does not hurt. It, it it could be like a tactile cue where the dog feels somebody a tap, and then they do what they need to do. the problem is that most people do not use it like that. They use it as a punisher. Or if the pet doesn't listen to the tap, they ramp it up and then they it can be very, very, very painful and scary. and you can't speak to animals. So because they don't know why this is happening, they call it a stem. It's a shock. Like that's what it is. It hurts.
Gia Voce 00:32:48 so a pet can't be like, oh, I'm getting shocked because I didn't listen to my cue. They start to think they're getting shocked because a dog showed up or a person showed up, or a person reached out their hand and the dog went to jump. And now they're getting shocked and they don't understand it's because they were jumping. They think that it's because a person was reaching for them. And you can develop really, really problematic behaviors like the dog becoming aggressive to the people, aggressive to dogs, or even the dog will turn and bite the handler, the their owner because they think that the thing is coming from them, or when they're in pain, they're redirected so they bite whatever is near them. And there's. Other ways to treat pets. Often you'll see with E color trainers to the goal is never to have a pet that the goal is to have strict obedience. So for many e collar trainers they are taking a dog that bites or has an issue and they're teaching the dog to heal and focus on the owner and not leave place.
Gia Voce 00:33:47 And they get pretty strong obedience because the pet is afraid to do the wrong thing. However, they're not getting what my clients want, and my clientele want to have a dog that is not stressed, feel safe in the environment, and can actually exist like a normal dog, and meet people. And my clients want to have friends over. They want their dog to have dog friends. Their goal is not strict obedience. So I think also like my clientele is going to look very different than a trainer that is just trying to get control over the dog.
Speaker 2 00:34:23 That makes so much sense. So it comes down to the philosophy.
Gia Voce 00:34:26 Yeah. And I care about what does your dog do when they're not under command? What is their choice when they're not under command.
Speaker 2 00:34:33 That's what I care about too.
Gia Voce 00:34:34 Yeah.
Speaker 2 00:34:35 Yeah. So back to moving to Portugal. This whole story is so inspiring to me because I've watched you speak this into existence. It's been so cool. And I wonder if you can talk about how you know when a decision is the right decision.
Speaker 2 00:35:01 We talk a lot about clarity on the podcast, and you have this really innate sense of trust in yourself, and I love for you to share that if you're comfortable.
Gia Voce 00:35:13 Yeah. So, two years ago, like I said, in February, I went to Portugal for the first time. I planned on going for two months. I decided I was going to do stay in the city and rent an apartment when I my previous trip I was in Colombia. I backpacked around, I had no itinerary, and I traveled all over on planes and buses, and we never spent any more than like a few days or a week in one place. So for this trip, I was like, I want to see what it's like to live in a city and to like it's my home. So I rented apartments and I immediately started getting myself out there and trying to make friends. And I made friends, like, super easily. I mostly meet people on dating apps, and then we often become friends. And so I instantly had like this friend group, and I was meeting like great people.
Gia Voce 00:36:08 And then they were introducing me to their friends. And then I was meeting people when I was going out. And so immediately, unlike here in the US, I had people to hang out with and go out with. Have dinner with. Grab coffee, have a drink with every day. I think over three months that I was there, I had maybe one day where I didn't hang out with somebody in three months.
Speaker 2 00:36:29 That is so like the American way.
Gia Voce 00:36:31 No, it is not the American way. And I think I knew right away that I wanted to move to Portugal. one of my friends was who's an entrepreneur also, and does tarot cards for personal development and some other business development cards as well. He was like, you knew you were going to move like right away, right away. And I was like, yeah, I did. But then you got to make sure because it's a big decision, right? So I did two months and then I stayed for a third month because I told myself I was on a special project with BuzzFeed, and I told myself if I made it into the third month, which only five people out of 40 were going to be asked to be on the final project, that I would stay an extra month, and I stayed an extra month because I made it, and then I just kept going back to Portugal.
Gia Voce 00:37:20 Yeah, I went to other countries in between, but I kept coming back because at that point I was like, okay, I really want to make sure that, like, this is the life I want to live. And I had wanted to purchase an apartment there, and then my dog got the noise phobia thing and I was like, shoot, maybe I don't want to live in the city. And what kind of place can I afford in the city? Maybe I want to live in the countryside and just I can drive into the city or get a little apartment at some point. So I then like, tried, you know, living not in the city to see how I liked that. And I liked it. And then I was like, okay, I'm going to move. And I put my house up for sale. And then a bunch of stuff was going on in my life and I got cold feet. So I pulled the house from sale, but I still went to Portugal to house hunt, and I did that for two and a half weeks with an amazing real estate agent who's now my friend.
Gia Voce 00:38:15 We just drove all over the countryside and all we looked at was farms and estates, and we had a great time. We brought my dog and also we brought his dog, and everybody liked the dogs. And so my dog went in every single house except one house, like everybody wanted her to hang out and participate. It was really, really cool. I saw amazing old places and a lot of places in Portugal. They big estates, they're expensive and they're a lot of work and there's not a big market for them. And it's so sad because so many estates, really old mansions, they don't get sold and they just fall into a state of disrepair, like these beautiful old houses with all the beautiful furniture inside. And I'm like, I was pretty resolved that, like, that's what I want to do. And I didn't see anything like I really was in love with. And then Pedro, the real estate agent, he found this house and I was like, that's over budget. I don't want to see it.
Gia Voce 00:39:12 And he's like, you don't know. Maybe they'll take less. And I was like, no, it's over budget. I don't want to see it. And he's like, well, I'm driving and I want to see it and it looks really cool. And we're going to go see it. And I'm like, oh. So we went and saw it and I was like, oh no, because I really liked it. I really, really liked it. And you know, I was kind of trying to find flaws with it because it was like way over budget, way, way over budget. And we ended up going back twice. So we saw it three times total. And then. In the end, I made an offer, but I pulled it because the bank hadn't evaluated the property and we were pretty sure the property was going to be evaluated really, really low and then I wouldn't be able to get a mortgage. So that's where it gets complicated. I, I could, I could kind of afford it with a mortgage if they took less.
Gia Voce 00:40:08 But we weren't sure we're not. And we still aren't sure. We still aren't sure that we're going to get. I'm going to be able to get a decent mortgage for it. This is all very confusing, but over the eight months that I've every single day texted my real estate agent, I want this house, I need this house. This is making me anxious. I want this house. I must have it literally every day. I'm very annoying, he said. I'm not the worst though, so I don't know who's worse than me. But there's somebody out there.
Speaker 2 00:40:34 but.
Gia Voce 00:40:35 But we did a bunch of research, and we figured out that the parts of the property that aren't legal, they eventually can be legalized, that the process is not so bad, that there's nothing like super red flag about the property. And we figured that, you know, the price that they're asking is worth it. And they wouldn't take any less, even though nobody's bought it in eight months. And during that eight months, I hustled really, really hard.
Gia Voce 00:40:59 And so now I can afford it. No matter what happens. And so I'm like, okay.
Speaker 2 00:41:06 That is so cool. Yeah. How do you trust that inner knowing, like, how does it come in for you when you just you knew you wanted to live in Portugal. You knew you wanted to live in that house. By the way, I remember when that house was in your stories in like early this year. And I remember thinking to myself, I think she's going to move there.
Gia Voce 00:41:26 That's so funny,
Speaker 2 00:41:29 Yeah. But how do you trust that that inner knowing.
Gia Voce 00:41:32 I mean, at first I felt like, very anxious about it, and I didn't feel like it was the right decision for me. there were things that were making me very nervous about that house, and, yeah, I wasn't ready. And so I while we're trying to figure out what's going on with the house, I wasn't like completely sold on it. But then I kept thinking about it, looking at pictures, looking at videos, researching, and then at at a certain point, and I had like a breakup with an American here and that then that was off the table.
Gia Voce 00:42:09 So there was really no reason for me to stay here at all. and in fact, it was a really good experience to see that, like, I'm going to prioritize myself and I'm going to do what I need to do, and it's going to have nothing to do with anybody else at all. so I guess my brain was able to work through what, what it would look like to live there, what my life could look like there. And not only that, because I couldn't afford it and it forced me to hustle it. It also made me see that I can work fully remote, and I can really do it like I can do this. And once I knew that I could do it, then I was like, okay, I could see my life here and then I had to have it. Does that make sense?
Speaker 2 00:42:51 Yes. Yeah, I love it.
Gia Voce 00:42:54 I had to prove it to myself that I can do it. Nothing bad is going to happen to me that I can't handle.
Gia Voce 00:42:59 And I can have, like, the lifestyle I've always dreamed of.
Speaker 2 00:43:06 I love that. You know I, I think that sometimes it's easy to forget or I'll speak for myself. It's easy to forget for me that the life I'm living is the life that I wanted to live for so long. And so when I think about pulling in the next iteration, sometimes I can feel like, oh, I don't know, I don't know. But then I remind myself, wait, but you did this. Like you're doing this.
Gia Voce 00:43:32 Yeah, exactly. If people, people are, like, constantly, like, I'm jealous of you. And I'm like, I'm jealous of myself. Like, this is crazy. This is literally. This is nuts. I always wanted to have a big farm, and I always wanted to have horses. And I always, you know, would go to these big estates like these big estate houses and be like, wow, I this is amazing. How cool would it be to do this? But it feels like so out of reach, especially as a single woman.
Gia Voce 00:44:00 Right? To to, do all this by yourself. And I always was like, I want to be able to travel whenever I want to, and I want to have like, a full life where I'm not just working a 9 to 5 and working for somebody else and getting stepped on all day, and I want to be able to I mean, the next iteration will be I'll get an apartment in the city so I can have my country house and an apartment in the city. But it's always been the dream. And in Europe, it's always been the dream.
Speaker 2 00:44:30 It's so good. Yeah. So good. I absolutely love it. Love it.
Gia Voce 00:44:35 And life is so short.
Speaker 2 00:44:37 Yeah.
Gia Voce 00:44:38 You know, but most people, they want it, but they don't make a move on it. Or it takes 20 years to make a move on it. And when I decided I was going to do it like I was going to do it.
Speaker 2 00:44:52 That's right. And you didn't try to make the move 20 steps down the road.
Speaker 2 00:44:57 You made the next move. So in some cases it was going back again to see the property or deciding that you wanted the hustle to get. You know. Yeah. The budget things to even out. It was just the next move, which I think is so important to remember. Yeah.
Gia Voce 00:45:14 And I'm willing to. I was willing to do whatever it takes, you know, even if it meant liquidating my retirement fund, even if it meant, you know, this is it's it's cool and it's exciting and it's fun, but also it's like a giant process because you have to get residency. I have a whole entire household full of stuff, and I have some, like, big equipment, like I have a full agility course and this £1,400 worth of dog water treadmill, you know, and I'm shipping my car and I have to bring all the animals and there's a lot of moving pieces, and you just have to take each one as it comes and handle it in the moment and not overthink it.
Speaker 2 00:45:56 Yes.
Gia Voce 00:45:57 Yeah. It's not like oh I'm just going to magically teleport there. Like this is a big deal.
Speaker 2 00:46:01 It is a big deal. Huge. Yeah. it's so exciting. Thank you for taking us along with the journey and sharing.
Gia Voce 00:46:09 It's super exciting. I think what I've realized traveling and living in Europe, is because I've been in Portugal six months out of the year for two years now. It's that is the lifestyle I want. That is where I'm happy. I look at videos of myself there and my friends take pictures and videos and I look really, really happy and it's not all happy and it's not all great. And there have been like really unfun times. But, ultimately, if I want my lifestyle to be full of connection with people and to be healthy and to be more free and to not be consumed by work and materialism.
Speaker 2 00:46:50 so, yeah.
Gia Voce 00:46:50 In order to have the lifestyle I want, I have to live somewhere else or I'm not going to be who I want to be.
Speaker 2 00:47:00 That's a mic drop moment. Yeah. Giving yourself permission to make the big move. To be who you want to be. Yeah, I'm really cool.
Gia Voce 00:47:11 And I'm in New York, so, you know, the stereotypes are true. Everybody's working a lot. Everybody's working really hard just to make ends meet. Everybody has, you know, two weeks of vacation and they go to not to knock people, but they go to, like, Disney World or they're going to go to resorts. And people don't get together for coffee every day, and they don't get together after work for a drink because they're too tired and they don't hang out in big friend groups after the age of like 21. And it's that's a fine life for many people, but it's not fine for me.
Speaker 2 00:47:50 You and I, I've talked about that a lot because we're both single. And so if we don't make a point to get out of the house and go have coffee or have a drink or have dinner, it can be really isolating.
Gia Voce 00:48:03 Yeah. You'll be alone.
Speaker 2 00:48:04 You'll be literally alone.
Gia Voce 00:48:05 You'll be alone. And I have lots of clients, so I socialize with my clients because many of my clients like me and you, we become friends, and it's great, but. And, you know, I have yoga, and I go to yoga class pretty much 6 or 7 days a week, and I have yoga friends, but it's not the same as like, people really being there and knowing you're going to go out to dinner five times a week with different people or go to dinner parties, it's just not the same.
Speaker 2 00:48:39 Well, I love this for you and can't wait to come visit.
Gia Voce 00:48:43 Yeah. Yeah you have to. I have plenty of space now.
Speaker 2 00:48:47 That's so amazing. So amazing. And you're going to take all your animals, which. Yeah. I hear so many people say, oh, I couldn't possibly because of the animals. But you've figured that out, too.
Gia Voce 00:48:58 Yeah. Three dogs and two cats. And I get offended because a lot of people have been like, well, what are you? You're moving to Europe.
Gia Voce 00:49:04 What are you going to do with your animals? And I'm like, you're insulting me right now. What do you mean? What am I going to do with the animals? I'm going to take my animals with me. Like, duh, I'm going to. I'm going to put them in the pound. Like, of course. Yeah. So I'm taking them with you. No, it's not going to be pleasant for them. Possibly, but it's going to be pleasant. What the outcome is for them.
Speaker 2 00:49:27 That's right, that's right. And they'll be cared for in the best way possible in the process.
Gia Voce 00:49:33 Yes.
Speaker 2 00:49:35 Yeah. Yeah. This has been amazing. Is there anything else that's on your mind or heart that you want to leave listeners with?
Gia Voce 00:49:43 I guess what I would say is people need to really think about what their life wants, what they want their life to look like, and, you know, have a fantasy in your head about what it could look like, even if it doesn't seem like it could ever be real.
Gia Voce 00:50:01 And then if you want it, you have to go for it. If it's important to you, you have to go for it. And you can't say, oh, I'm going to try next year. Like decide and then do it.
Speaker 2 00:50:12 Decide and then do it. Decide to do it. I love that. Thank you so much for being here. And thank you for the impact that you've made on my life and the impact that you've made on Bentley's life. I'm looking down because he's right by my feet. Oh.
Gia Voce 00:50:28 You're welcome. Hi, Bentley. My dogs are all over here, too.
Speaker 2 00:50:33 Amazing.
Brenda Winkle 00:50:36 Oh, my goodness, I loved this episode. Gia. Thank you so much for being a guest. I hope you loved this too. If you did, would you do me a favor? Would you tag us both me and Gia in your stories on social media, and share this with every person who wants to live joyfully and intuitively and follow those dreams, even if it scares them? And would you also share this episode with any dog lovers that you know? Because there is another way besides collar training, there is another way besides giving up ninja.
Brenda Winkle 00:51:11 She will shoot it to you straight. So I just I admire her and respect her so deeply. So if you haven't followed Gere across all her social platforms, she is at thinking, thinking canine. And the last time we spoke she was approaching a million followers across all platforms. So go give her a follow and she also has a free guide for you. She has a free gift and I'm going to put the link in the show notes. It is a kit for you. It is a thank you so much for being a guest. I absolutely loved sharing space with you and I bet you enjoyed this conversation too. In fact, I have a request for you. Could you please share this episode with every dog lover that you know to make sure that they know there are other options and other experts out there that can provide them with the support that they need to really care for and love and support their fur babies. And if you love this episode and you know someone who also is wanting to live courageously and to follow those intuitive nudges and do things because it scares them, be sure they that you share this episode with them too.
Brenda Winkle 00:52:25 And as always, I'm always requesting for you to leave the podcast for rating and review. But before I go today, I want to make sure you know that there is a very special gift that Gia has left for you, and that is her free e-book. It's called ten tips for Building a Healthy Relationship with Your Dog. I'm going to put the link in the show notes. Be sure you go grab it. Thank you so much for listening. Bye for now. Until next time.
